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000150_icon-group-sender_Tue Nov 7 12:31:08 2000.msg
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Received: (from root@localhost)
by baskerville.CS.Arizona.EDU (8.11.1/8.11.1) id eA7JTns10937
for icon-group-addresses; Tue, 7 Nov 2000 12:29:49 -0700 (MST)
Message-Id: <200011071929.eA7JTns10937@baskerville.CS.Arizona.EDU>
Date: Tue, 07 Nov 2000 09:46:54 -0700
From: OpMan <nrc@northrim.net>
X-Accept-Language: en
To: icon-group@cs.arizona.edu
Subject: Re: Why Perl?
Errors-To: icon-group-errors@cs.arizona.edu
Status: RO
Content-Length: 3504
Greetings,
As a "lurker" on this list for quite a while now I've read some
very interesting posts, including this "Perl vs. Icon" thread...
As a ISP sysadmin for the last 7 years I can give you my own "slant".
I think Perl "got a leg up" on Icon. They are both powerful languages
but
Perl simply got more exposure early on. Sure, O'Reilly helped out and
many
sysadmins, including myself, are O'Reilly readers. Let's face it,
say the acronym "cgi" and most folks think "Perl". Not Icon, Python or
any number of other useful languages...
But friends, the future is uncertain. Look at the case of Sendmail
and Qmail. Sendmail had been established for years as an email MTA.
O'Reilly
has published 2 editions on Sendmail as well and, at least in the UNI*
world,
Sendmail held sway.
Then this upstart MUA, Qmail, arrives on the scene and starts making
converts and believers of even the most loyal of Sendmail admins. Why?
Well, my
opinion is that Sendmail got too complex, too full of "features" and too
easy to
compromise from a system security point of view. I converted my email
system to
Qmail as soon as I read through the docs (just text files included with
the
distribution, no "man" pages at all!) and found Qmail would solve my
"realworld
problems". I could realize a time savings as well... (read: get my
personal
life back)
So who can say? I'm seeing JSP and PHP replacing Perl even now in some
areas. Another language, REBOL, being developed by Carl Sassenrath of
Amiga fame,
is showing great promise as well. REBOL tries to solve a number of
issues in
communicating information across the 'net. We'll see...
Perhaps an O'Reilly Icon book and some useful "real world" applications
(read: "Internet oriented and make my life simpler") might convert more
to the
"Icon faithful" as well.
And O'Reilly hasn't even published a book on Qmail yet.... :^)
Operations Manager
North Rim Communications
"The more the words, the less the meaning, and how does that profit
anyone?"
Ecclesiates 6:1
Chris.D.Tenaglia@jci.com wrote:
>
> I think it was written by someone who didn't know that icon was available.
> They reinvented a bumpy retread wheel that still got from point A to point
> B.
> After that, the rest has "marketing" and "evangelism". Yes, O'Reily helps a
> lot. When you get Freeware Internet suites and Web Server software on
> CDs, PERL is always there. Having a web page and ftp site are useful, but
> not as effective for mass distribution and indoctrination as a million CDs.
> Once they print "hello"; they're hooked. ;-) And once the sys admins make
> it their corporate standard, icon is like a 3rd party. And then training
> companies
> teach PERL but not icon, just reinforces the glum situation.
> Chris Tenaglia, technical analyst, Johnson Controls
> ---------------------- Forwarded by Chris D Tenaglia/CORP/Johnson_Controls
> on 11/07/2000 08:45 AM ---------------------------
>
> NOSPAM.frank@binartek.com on 11/06/2000 12:44:07 PM
>
> To: icon-group@CS.Arizona.EDU
> cc:
> bcc:
>
> Subject: Why Perl?
>
> I have used Icon for over a decade. Recently, I went through the Perl
> tutorial. For the most part, I am amazed that Perl has become the dominant
> language for text processing. About the only area where Perl could be
> considered to Icon is in report generation, and even this advantage could
> be
> obtained in Icon with the appropriate library. Why, then, has Perl become
> so
> popular while Icon remains (relatively) obscure?
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